Author Topic: New to RV- Sensing the target  (Read 2357 times)


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Re: New to RV- Sensing the target
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2016, 08:25:35 PM »
Thank you all very much. This is very helpful! My ideograms come naturally, but then I don't know what the heck they are sometimes. Sometimes they are very straightforward. Other times, they are more like a combo between 2 ideograms, like liquid/ mountain, a being/ liquid, or mountain/ structure. Interestingly, my energy ideograms always comes out as energy only. And I am beginning to see that it is a matter of practice and repetition!

I guess I am just going to have to figure out with time what language my subconscious is going to use!  :)


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Re: New to RV- Sensing the target
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2016, 12:52:07 AM »
... 2 ideograms, like liquid/ mountain, a being/ liquid, or mountain/ structure....

It's not quite cut and dried as you seem to be thinking it might be. Even if you're just practicing by saying mountain then allowing an ideogram to be drawn you're still dealing with ego.

Assuming you're practicing,,, are you getting a mental image when you say the word? I'll wager the answer is yes and the image will be of something you have already seen/experienced.

Mountains have streams, beings take baths/swim/drink liquids/are near water such as streams, lakes etc and there are cabins/electrical poles/etc on mountains.

Even when you're not practicing more than one "object" in an ideogram isn't unusual because you will normally see an entire "area" until you're able to focus on the actual target. Depending on your target of course.

More than one item in an ideogram is nothing to worry about. It in fact is a step up when you recognize it is more than one object.


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Re: New to RV- Sensing the target
« Reply #12 on: February 20, 2017, 03:31:11 AM »
There is a "tasking context" and then there is "the target" which is the "focus" -- and the psychological definition for this ('within' whatever the actual tasking and cue are) is "what is most important and relevant" about (the tasker's request, or whatever else you want to gear your viewing toward).

In any feedback there are many things, but we don't care about the light poles and postal boxes (unless those were the target), we care about the building that is the focus (for example). What is most important and relevant to the tasker's desire (or the viewing outcome need) could be anything -- and not just physical data of course -- but it probably won't be trivia.

Basics of the target's foundation for existence will usually come through in a session. E.g. unlikely to have a good session on a war plane without something related to the war. Unlikely to have a good session on a bikini without the curvy girl wearing it (or even the archetype of curvy girls wearing them). And that may be so even when that data is not part of feedback (aside from "implicitly implied"). But that's in session; hopefully the ideograms will be the basics.

For ideograms, the 'potential' of this is a boatload of information "furled up" into something akin to a spontaneous symbol. Yes, it is true that nearly all targets will have multiple gestalts, as we call them, although you can actually entrain yourself to ideograms that cover all kinds of things not just gestalts (you can "stage 1 a session" as I call it -- use S1 itself, repeatedly, as the whole collection process, though usually some 3 (sketching) or 4.5 (~sentence describing) is needed eventually).

It's important when you are talking to yourself, your mind, that your expectations are clear. Your mind is your friend and you're establishing a communications relationship with it. If your aims are tenuous, armophous, vague and fuzzy, your data may be too.

Particularly when you are beginning something new, there is nothing wrong with getting a small collection of data, stopping, get feedback. The emphasis on many stages and often 3 hour sessions kills more viewing enthusiasm... and worse, both creates a ridiculous emphasis on emotional reaction to result (because it was such a huge effort), and ends up with either so much data you don't easily know what data point 'experience' of yours in session, relates to what data in the target, or, the experience was simply so long ago, and in the midst of others and other things, that by the time feedback comes you don't even remember it well. It's good to use tasks that aren't so difficult to come by as those made by another person just for you right then, in this case, so you don't feel like you are 'wasting' a task.

If you're doing fairly traditional viewing, you want to set an 'expectation and demand' of your mind and body: it is going to give you a spontaneous 'reflex motion' in the hand with the pen, which will draw a shape on the paper (Scribbliograms as my buddy Ed the Toad humorously called them), and that process plus 'revisiting' a focus on its end result on paper, will lead to at least some impression about what gestalt it may be. That is your expectation and request of self.

So, you want the gestalt/s that is most important and relevant. You don't want every gestalt there can be or you start losing the point of it. If a person using a machine is the focus of the feedback, you want what is most important about this target, which may be either of those, both of those, or something else not even in feedback but implied (e.g. a person the machine is affecting).

There may be more than one 'major' gestalt in the target, true. Only if it's important and relevant do you really want it though. You want to exit stage 1 -- in a perfect world, which is not always going to happen -- with a sense of the major focus. If it's a giant bulldozer/landmover, it doesn't matter that it's sitting in a nice stretch of flat land, just next to a small mountain, in front of a small body of water. What matters is that it's a thing, as opposed to a person or a river or an event. You might get the bulldozer and also its "process" in a session like that, once you get the hang of this. But for Stage 1 you really just want the low-level gestalts that mean the most.

Your mind may give you more than traditional gestalts, sooner or later. 'Death' is something that came through in my ideograms pretty early. Trees or recurring-vertical-like-structures often come through for people. "Composite" ideograms (to which Fletch referred earlier in the thread) are not uncommon but are obviously a little more difficult to figure out. If you lean on your mind to give you 'one important thing, and then I will ask if there is something else' - so if it wants more data to get through, it will have the opportunity - hopefully it will agree. Ids can be as complex or simple as desired, and some people can 'feel' a lot from 'touching' them with pen or finger and other people just have to get used to recognizing the shape from experience.

But ask your mind for what you want, be firm, 'expect it' and 'accept it.' (And say thank you for it.) Doing stage-1 only exercises I consider fairly important, as long as you don't make it into a trivial/throwaway thing. You want every data collection exercise to have a sense of single-focus and importance.

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