Dowsing

River

New Member
#1
Hi Everyone,

As I have never done any dowsing before I'd be interested to read about how others go about it.

If you are a dowser or have even just dabbled in dowsing could you give me some direction on how to give it a go?

Thanks
River
 

energycritter

energycritter@y ahoo.com
#2
OK, that was interesting, I have never registered in something like this before. Nifty little thing, it all went very well for me, I am now here.

OK, my point for registering is to give a small answer, one of the many answers, to River's question.

OK, this technique is a form of body dowsing and it was run through me word of mouth and it is also contained in books by David R. Hawkins.

It goes like this. Hold one hand with the pointing finger and the thumb joined making a circle or a loop like you would if you were indicating that soemthing was, "OK". Then, place your other hand's pointing finger and thumb inside of the loop about half way in as if you are wanting to pry the loop open with your other fingers from the inside.

The object is to coordinate the holding of the loop closed with a reasonable amount of effort, nothing real demanding, while trying to pry the finger and thumb upart, thereby opening the loop, with the other hand, or fingers that you inserted into the loop.

You do this prying attempt while (for practice, to get the feel) you say that your name is whatever your name truely is. Then, try this technique while stating that your name is a name that it truely is not.

You should be able to keep the loop closed when you state truth, hence, state your true name and the loop will stay closed and your finger and thumb will not come apart. When you state a non-truth, your wrong name, the loop will come apart for a split nano-second.

You will be able to practice this and in about a month or so, you should be able to feel the diference in a weak/non-truth responce and a strong/truth responce that enables the loop to remain closed. Of course, more could be said, but, that may help get you started. Then, try new statements and whatnot. I hope I didn't babble too much. That was fun....ta ta for now...BC
 

EricT

New Member
#3
Joe McMoneagles book, Mind Trek, goes over some interesting associative dowsing techniques, using blinking of the eyes.  I haven't done it, but thats another physical ARV(usage?) kind of thing.

Eric

Correction- This was out of RV secrets, starting on page 186- and I will note so lower in the thread as well.
 

Liz

New Member
#4
.
Hi energycritter and Eric,

Energycritter, that technique reminds me of kineseology, the art of finding out what's wrong with the body by muscle testing. It's interesting how our bodies react to truth.

So how would you go about using it to find something? Would you keep asking a yes/no question until you got a yes? Or would you run your linked fingers over a map?

Eric can you remember what Joe said about blinking?

Liz
 
#5
Re: Dowsing cops and 007 dowsing

Hey Liz-

Before I get to the blinking, I should add a few things.

I have learned to RV.  I have not learned squat about dowsing.  Except for one kinda thingy I will explain in a minute.  So take my dowsing advice with a full salt shaker.

That said...

A few weeks ago, JimK(my mentor) and I were talking, and he mentioned that he was driving down the freeway, and he got this crystal clear picture of a cop car.  He mentioned to his girlfriend(present at the time) that the image came just like RV data.  HE slowed up a bit, and over the next hill... a cop.  

He kept thinking about this, and he "felt" out 2 more CHPs prior to seeing them.

So... I figured maybe there is some sort of feedback loop, where you can program your sub to wake you up under given condition A.  So I tried this...  the entire next week, I could tell where just about every cop was before I saw them.  This is purely anecdotal mind you, but still... wow.  I couldnt believe how well it worked.

I think dowsing kinda works the same way.  You program your body to do "something" under given condition A, whether thats walking over a good well spot, telling the truth, locating something...  Etc.  Joe used blinking in the following manner, and this is paraphrased, I lent my book out to Jim.  

He ran a ruler down a map, and told himself, when I pass over the point (of whatever) I will blink.  Once done in the horizontal direction, he did it again in the vertical, providing 2 intersecting lines that make a "target fix".

I remember this part clearly- he was doing the blinking as he did not want the people watching him with the map to know where he got his "fix".  Very super secret spy.  Pretty cool.  Joe would tell them to go to one place, while he would run off seperately to the real target fix.

I have thought about training myself to blink when people are lying... but it seems so obvious to me already via non-verbal communications.  Well, sometimes.  Most people are very bad liars  Watching where people look, eye contact, that sorta thing.  I think maybe the blinking could be used better for something else?

But it seems that all the ARV methods (again, am I using that term right here?) stem from programming your own sub to make you do something physical under a certain condition.  A twitch, blink, movement.

Again, I dont know much but from what I have read... although I did recently run a target where a person got blasted with a shovel (no feedback yet, just my theory) and early in the session (prior to my forming that hypothesis) my head jerked to one side and I got a mean pain in one of my teeth.  So, the programming thing seems to be a 2 way street, lol.

Eric

Oh, and by the way- Energycritter and River- Welcome to TKR!  Enjoy your stay here!  Lots of good discussion to follow.   ;D
 

Gecko

New Member
#6
Wow, cool idea about the blinking. I'm not very good at allowing my subconscious to control my body movement. WHen I hold a pendulum it doesn't move unless I look away and then try to sneak a peek. Then maybe it will move, LOL! Perhaps the blinking will be easier because the sub is already mainly in charge of that. Right now, when asked to map dowse, I just pick a spot that feels right. It's not very sophisticated!
-E
 

Liz

New Member
#7
I love that blinking idea too!

The only time I have ever done dowsing was for a target Eva set up once. She gave us a simple map and we had to find where the hidden item was.

I just used my mental hand to run over the page and feel for where it was. I can't remember how I went because we could also try and RV what the item was and I was more interested to doing that at the time.

Gecko I think I've got the same trouble with not letting the sub take control. I find using any sort of physical tool, including drawing ideograms, distracting.

But I guess it boils down to practice like everything else. I just need to practice letting go and relaxing I guess. Maybe I should go and do some of that right now. All in the name of practice you understand. :p

Liz
 

energycritter

energycritter@y ahoo.com
#8
Eric / Liz, yes, what I mentioned is Kinesiology, I guess....I am not real versed in the terminoly guidlines and whatnot. It is discussed at length in the books I mentioned, or, in the books by the author I mentioned.

Kinesiology is used often for body diagnostic stuff as you (Liz) mentioned. It has also been found to work well with the binary yes/no stuff you also mentioned.

I guess I plan on using the word "mentioned" a lot today. ha ha...well, anyway, the piont I really was wanting to make was the idea that the body has the ability to not only react to its own health issues, but, it is able to react to the existance of truth or non-truth.

If the collective of existance has record of an event or thought or anything for that matter that does truely exist, then the body can be strong during a test as result of the truth in the collective conscience of existance, so to speak.

I really can not do the author I mentioned (see, that word again) any justice by trying to explain what he has done so well in his books, Oh well. Main point, if something is not true, or, has no actual representation existing in the collective, on record or on file, so to speak, then, the body has a slight drop in strength for the minutest instant.

David, in his books, explains that it is like an athlete that is filled with pride about his own abilities, a non-truth, since all humanity has abilities, so to speak, and if this athlete competes and has a good run, lets say, but does that while feeling humble and simply a developed human like others, he is competing against, then tries to repeat the good run while in pride, the non-truth of his prideful state has the ability to cause his muscles to go weak for an instant during the run and he ends up not doing as well during that run.

Poeple have always wondered why athletes have different quality of days, well, it could just be that the pride and non-truthful state of their mind has been playing games with their actual bodies abilities because of the non-truth about themselves that they hold in their heart. hence, the Eastern strugle to obtain the ZEN state of so called no-mind, removing the weakening charactoristics of the EGO.

Regards to all, BC
 

Fire

New Member
#9
Joe McMoneagles book, Mind Trek, goes over some interesting associative dowsing techniques, using blinking of the eyes.  I haven't done it, but thats another physical ARV(usage?) kind of thing.
ARV is a tasking protocol used for types of targets normally difficult to differentiate via regular RV. (See Firedocs FAQ24: http://www.firedocs.com/remoteviewing/faq024.cfm )

Most forced-choice psi could be considered dowsing depending on how it was done; dowsing with the body is generally called kinesiology although that term specifically denotes muscle testing as opposed to programmed twitches, etc.

More further down the thread...

Fire
 

Fire

New Member
#10
Re: Dowsing cops and 007 dowsing

I have learned to RV.  I have not learned squat about dowsing.  Except for one kinda thingy I will explain in a minute.  So take my dowsing advice with a full salt shaker.
Goes for anybody. ;) Some RV methods contain dowsing as a "tool" within them. But dowsing is really an art just as large as RV itself.

He kept thinking about this, and he "felt" out 2 more CHPs prior to seeing them.
Sure, you can program yourself for most anything.

One time a highly skeptical friend was driving with another fellow in L.A., and their light turns green at an intersection, and the guy puts his arm in front of my friend and yells NOT YET! when he begins to drive. My friend stops, looks at him, and then this car goes *zooming* past that would have hit them. The guy says casually, "OK now." LOL! My friend was just going on about how weird it was, as if that guy were 'waiting for' that car. I said, "He was." (Not like he believed me. lol.)

So... I figured maybe there is some sort of feedback loop, where you can program your sub to wake you up under given condition A.
You can do this with sleep as well. I haven't worked on this in years, but I used to be a hypnosis freak. I could wake myself up to the minute at any time, and under any circumstance. I had what I considered "levels of disturbance" that I would set before I slept, where 1=The slightest whisper or sound or motion would alert me instantly, to 10=Sleep like the dead even if the house burns down around me, lol. It wasn't long before I realized I could set my waking for other events, which is one of the thing that started opening my mind to psi a little more, as I couldn't find any other way to explain how that could be possible.

I think dowsing kinda works the same way.  You program your body to do "something" under given condition A, whether thats walking over a good well spot, telling the truth, locating something...  Etc.
Yes, I think so. I think of it like, my body knows. Whatever, anything I intend for it to know. Getting that information through my thick skull is another story. ;D Dowsing is cool because it escapes the translation requirements except one that you program. But that one has to be extensively practiced, with feedback, to be 'reliable' to the degree we want it to be for an RV session. It's often a lot easier to do stuff 'casually' than it is for disciplined RV. Look at the number of people who work on RVing lottery numbers, fail consistently, then the ONE TIME the tasker doesn't buy a ticket, they nail them!-- I think for whatever subconscious reason, they weren't ready to win the lotto, but when that was no longer a threat, they got a lucky psi break lol. ::)

He ran a ruler down a map, and told himself, when I pass over the point (of whatever) I will blink.  Once done in the horizontal direction, he did it again in the vertical, providing 2 intersecting lines that make a "target fix".
The approach normally taught in traditional RV methods is to use the ruler, feel for a sense, or a sharp point on your leading finger, or a warm spot, or... whatever works for you, from three sides of the page so as to triangulate a final range of space.

I have thought about training myself to blink when people are lying
I'm more curious about why you'd think this is so common you'd need to bother dowsing for it. ;D I'd also think a better method would be in order, since humans DO blink for other reasons than somebody lying to them!--in a map dowsing session, it's brief, you can really force the eyes to not blink for 'ordinary' reasons so when they do it's a twitch. But meeting someone and talking with them for 20 minutes, well your eyes ARE going to blink, and if it makes you distrust whatever they are saying at that moment, that could be a problem. :-[
Most people are very bad liars
The good ones are really frightening. Usually they're good because they're pathological and they've been doing it every 5 minutes since they were 8 or something--they're usually almost deadly to have anywhere near you, since the more someone lies the more paranoid they tend to be about being found out.

I'd like to be better at lying, but aside from having one of those faces that almost spells out my feelings in outline format for the whole watching world, I'm also just not that smart! I have a hard time keeping track of what I say that IS true--so trying to keep track of stories and details that aren't, and remember what I told who no less, is frankly too much for me! Once in a great while I tell some little lie to family like about why I'm not attending some function and eventually I always screw it up and it comes out that I was just trying to make them feel better while I shined them on, LOL, and then I'm in deep you know what socially. ;D

I think maybe the blinking could be used better for something else?
Something brief so you can refrain from blinking except as the twitch.

But it seems that all the ARV methods (again, am I using that term right here?)
Addressed above. ARV is not dowsing. ARV is free-response RV just like RV is. However, ARV is a tasking protocol that tells people to describe the feedback they will be shown at a future date, instead of telling them to describe 'the target'.

I've known people who used body-dowsing with finger twitches and their hands in their pockets.

I did recently run a target where a person got blasted with a shovel (no feedback yet, just my theory) and early in the session (prior to my forming that hypothesis) my head jerked to one side and I got a mean pain in one of my teeth.
LOL. Reminds me of a target I got that had a bomb. The session was early in, and I wasn't getting much data, and then this POW! inside me literally scared the crap out of me, I bet I jumped 2 inches. I also tend to get physical feelings of being in/part of/experiencing the target or situation sometimes. Usually this denotes good target contact so if I realize it, it's worth really pursuing that session.

Fire
 
#11
OK, I tried that system with the fingers in a loop with the other hands' fingers trying to break the loop. Didn't have much luck though, except my fingers are tired now! I think I may be way too lazy for that method, hehe. ;D
-E
 

energycritter

energycritter@y ahoo.com
#12
Too funny Gecko. I have had that same result. The back of my hand near the pointing finger being used to try and open the loop can get very sore while practicing.

Sorry...this technique may not be of much help to anyone. Oh well. I guess it could be a good exercise for poeple that want to loose pounds in their finger, like mini-sit-ups. It may take a long time to get a feel for it...? I do not know.

A way to try the technique in an attempt to remove possible mentation overtones and whatnot could be to test health supliments useing a type of protocal where you have someone else hide the contents of a few sperate items that you may need. Then, test each item stating that this product is what I need for this symtom, or whatnot, and then, maybe, you will be able to experience a distinction between results and then also see if you tested for the product you knew you needed to ingest as opposed to the other item that could have been bleech, for example. You should test weak to the need to ingest bleech, ha ha. I do not know, just playing with ya'll.

I have seen the best results with supliments. In fact, I have seen people that need a certain thing for sure and when testing to confirm, they tested no. Well, in mor ethan one instance, the container was empty and that was not known by the tester. BC
 

Fire

New Member
#13
Re: Kinesiology

Here's a page where Michaelle has pics and descriptions of the process energycritter is talking about.

http://tinyurl.com/ghhv
 

Fire

New Member
#14
Gecko, I first learned that "break the finger loop" thing from a book by Michaelle Small Wright, calling "Behaving As If the God In All Life Matters". I bought the book because I loved the title. It's an autobiography written when she was considerably younger. She had a helluva childhood. She ended up doing gardening in a project called Perelandra (there's an interesting book trilogy C.S. Lewis has with that title), similar to the Findhorn Community that got such attention a few decades ago. I worked on this for about three days and to my amazement, you get the hang of it really quickly. At first it's either impossible to tell or you get wrong answers, but after you practice it a bit, you can do it instantly and feel confident about not only yes/no, but also 'hesitant' yes or no and 'reluctant' yes or no and so forth. I think like anything else it's just practice.

I might add I once tried to Stage5 an entire RV target by using this kinesiology technique. The session sucked. Well, so it ain't perfected. ;D

Fire
 

Liz

New Member
#15
Thanks for the link Fire.

"Behaving As If the God In All Life Matters" was one of the most inspiring 'nature' books I've read.

Liz
 
#16
you can't hid those lying eyes...

I couldn't help myself, I saw the Eagles in concert Friday at the MCI Center(DC)

Seriously, if you want to detect lies check out The Warriors Edge (ISBN 0-380-71674-7), by John Alexander. Included in that book, along with lots of other stuff (rv etc.) is an explanation of how one's eyes move depending on how they are processing information

When recalling something previously seen most people look up and to the left. Down and to the left indicates an internal dialog, perhaps running thru how there next statement might sound. Six movements in all and they are reversed in some people.

This is a great book for anyone's rv library. The 1990 book is out of print, I had a hard time finding a reasonably priced copy, but I finally did.

Now I gotta go back in Mind Trek and see what all this stuff is about blinking, cause I don't remember that.
 
#17
Now I gotta go back in Mind Trek and see what all this stuff is about blinking, cause I don't remember that.
Well, you might have a hard time, in that... I quoted the wrong book. Tat is out of RV secrets, starting on page 186. I apologize for the confusion.

I read both books at about the same time, hence my blurred memory of which book had what content in it.

::)

Eric
 
#18
dowser, what Alexander was referring to in that book is covered in the field of NeuroLinguistic Programming (NLP for short). There are quite a few books out about this and it's a really fascinating topic. Fire
 

energycritter

energycritter@y ahoo.com
#19
The following is a portion of some things that I said to Liz/River that may help her and she mentioned that I should post this here also. So, here it is.

Make sure that you do not ask questions, you must make claer and simple statements.

Like....

Aliens made the pyramids.

Aliens helped make the pyramids.

Try and practice on the feeling of yes and no by stateing things that are clearly yes and no to you, such as, your name and then state a false name.

My name is bozo.....you should go weak...
My name is Liz.....you should remain strong...

You should be able to feel the difference and then recognize that feeling a little better when actually making the real statement about what you do not know.

keep trying.....

BC the EC