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Archivist: Palyne PJ Gaenir (PJRV, Palyne, Firedocs RV, TKR and the Dojo Psi.)

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pjrv : Messages : 1732-1738 of 4038


From: Karl Boyken Date: Thu Dec 12, 2002 9:01 am Subject: PK in dreams kboyken I sometimes have dreams in which I can move things around mentally. I had one last night. It seemed so real and vivid that I didn't even notice I was dreaming, unfortunately. It was so easy to move things, including myself. I was excited because I'd found the key to doing PK effortlessly. It was a matter of relaxing deeply, letting go, and sinking into some special kind of altered state. And then I woke up. I wonder why people have PK dreams. Anyone care to speculate? -- Karl Boyken kboyken...t http://soli.inav.net/~kboyken/ We dance 'round in a ring and suppose, while the Secret sits in the middle and knows. --Robert Frost Reply | Forward


From: "PJ Gaenir " Date: Thu Dec 12, 2002 9:25 am Subject: Re: PK in dreams dennanm > Karl wrote > I sometimes have dreams in which I can move things > around mentally. When I was 18 (and had lucid dreamed and OBEd all my life), I got vaguely interested in TK. Not a big deal, just thought it was a curious concept and rather fit into some offbeat stuff that I 'wasn't sure about' but suspected might relate in my life. One night, as I was falling asleep, I left my body, and was sitting there on the edge of my bed (er, so to speak) while my body was lying there on its back in bed. I was looking at my dresser. I was thinking of an experience I'd had recently, where, after deciding that my entire view on life was summed up in the lifting of one eyebrow, I really wanted to learn to do it. I couldn't do it in the mirror, but in a dream, I had done it. And I had clearly FELT it, felt the muscle that did it, and realized that the muscle-place I'd expected wasn't exactly the area that did the work. I have the dubious talent of wiggling my ears, which not everybody can do, and I always wondered why when we all have the same muscles, some of us "know" where the muscle to lift an eyebrow or wiggle an ear is, and some of us don't. I'd found the muscle for the eyebrow in the dream. (Note: but still couldn't do it in waking life.) So as I was sitting there musing on this, it occurred to me suddenly that perhaps TK was like some kind of muscle. That some people knew where it was and some people didn't. I knew I could move stuff around in dreams, and had even had a couple where I asked someone in the dream to 'teach' me TK and they did, and it was easy in the dream, but of course impossible on awakening. But as I looked at my dresser I thought, well out of body isn't exactly the same thing as a dream, though. Like right now, I am "right next to" the reality that my body lives in. Maybe a couple steps left... but close enough my room looks the same and I can see my body lying here (I didn't look closely - always freaked me). So I said to myself, "Let me FEEL the 'muscle' used for TK -- and I mean in the REAL WORLD, not just in dreams." And I looked closely at my dresser and focused on an object on it and lifted it. And I could *feel* it almost as physically as I had felt the muscle that lifted my eyebrow. I started getting excited, thinking, oh man, I've done it! I've found it! I moved a few other things. And I knew that *if I could do this while conscious and IN my body, I could do TK.* I knew that it was just DOing and feeling that 'muscle' (sic) MOVE stuff. I was so excited! I said to myself, ok. You MUST wake your body up right now while you have it in your head, and DO it - really quick, first thing. If you just do this OBE and wait until I eventually end up back in body or drift off to something else and fall 'asleep' or whatever, I'll have forgotten it -- like the eyebrow muscle -- I need to do it NOW. So I turned and DIVED back into my body. It WOULD NOT WAKE UP. I pounded on it from the inside. I yelled and screamed at it. I eventually was SO frustrated I started crying at the unfairness of this damned stupidly-dead-lump of flesh that was the only thing standing in my way from "bringing this into my reality" with me. I fought and yelled and pounded and cried from the inside of my inert body until I was totally exhausted. Finally I told myself in despair, "Well... just THINK of it. Over and over and over and over. We'll just THINK of it repeatedly enough as we fall asleep [I was exhausted and sleepy by then] that when I wake up, it's the FIRST THING I will think of." When I woke up, the first thing I thought of was TK all right. Had no memory of 'where' that muscle was, or how it felt, or how to do it. I was genuinely depressed for a week about it. Didn't happen to have any conscious OBEs in that time, and decided to read a book about them so maybe I could just do it whenever I wanted. After reading the book, 90% of my conscious OBEing vanished. I don't know if it was putting it in my left brain or what. To me the whole book seemed to spend so much effort reassuring the readers that it was possible -- which I'd never doubted, that's obvious -- that it had like a reverse psychology effect on me. And there was stuff like, I think it said if you slept on your right side, it was less likely? -- in my whole life I'd never been able to sleep on my right side; suddenly, I could not sleep in any other position! Clearly there was a lot of psychological stuff involved. So, OBEs from that point happened, but were always spontaneous and were much less common than they had been until that point in my life. Never found the TK 'muscle' again. ;-) PJ Reply | Forward


From: "Eva " Date: Thu Dec 12, 2002 11:24 am Subject: Re: PK in dreams k9caninek9 PJ, I wonder if you had basically tasked yourself with something you could not do. Basically, you strongly intended to go back into your body with certain information to go with you. Maybe going in the body is a state that precludes certain things or ways of thought. Or maybe it just wasn't allowed or right for you at that time. And so you couldn't go back it. It's like when a dog decides to go through his doggy door while he is carrying a huge meaty leg bone in his mouth. Every time he tries to stick his head through the little door, the bone slams into the side of the house and he can't get it in. And he's not smart enough to take it in sideways! Maybe the muscle you need out of body is not the same muscle you need in body either. Well now there is a lot of maybes! -E

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