pjrv : Messages : 1681-1689 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/1681?)
23:16:57
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#1681
From: "PJ Gaenir "
Date: Mon Dec 9, 2002 4:34 pm
Subject: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? dennanm
I had a rather weird day today.
My daughter Rykah, age 6, met a girl in her first grade class whom
she instantly bonded to. She's been crazy about her since the minute
they laid eyes on each other; the girl's name is Brooklyn. Over the
last few weeks I've often given her rides home, as she walks to
school. Her mother is in her mid-20's and about 5 days ago gave
birth to her fourth child (none with a resident father alas), so
she's got Brooklyn, 7, a boy 3, a girl 18 months, and now a boy
newborn. She lives in a teeny welfare house near the school.
I have really felt for Brooklyn and figured she was probably a big
help to her mother with the other kids. Her mom has been oddly
reluctant to let Brooklyn come play and I figured it was because she
wanted her help dealing with the little ones (since until last week
she was too hugely pregnant to hardly move). Today I talked with her
mother for awhile.
Brooklyn, seven, was recently released from in-patient care.
Apparently in one city they had lived in not long ago, she was
checked out for very odd behavior, and based mostly on her drawings,
they decided she had post traumatic stress disorder. Her mother said
she has never been abused, beyond not getting enough attention due to
single mom with small siblings, and I realize all abusive parents or
those in denial might say that, but I actually believed her, just
based on my limited exposure to her. Well they moved here I guess a
year ago.
Brooklyn took to walking out into the street and standing in front of
cars, or lying down in the street. Welfare neighborhoods don't have
fences... she was old enough to stay in the yard and away from the
street, my kid does at this age. People who nearly killed her would
drag her in the house (she had escaped out the back of her room, a
window with no screen, and went around) and says that she told
them "You can hit me. I can't be killed. I have special powers."
Apparently she honestly believed this. (A few months ago.)
Her mom said she once heard this pounding sound and walked in the
living room and Brooklyn was whacking her forehead/face against the
wall to the point it was bleeding. When she was dragged back and
asked why, she said, "They told me to." Who?! "The voices."
A few months ago she tried to strangle her 3 year old brother. She
said the voices told her to do it. When her mother insisted she tell
the voices to shut up and go away, she insisted she couldn't, there
were too many of them, they were too loud, too strong, too scary. Her
mom said, "I can't HELP her!" - and had a pretty darn genuine frantic
and frustrated mother sound I took seriously.
The psychs locally said the child was schizophrenic and put her on
medication. Her mother said another doc told her that is something a
person is born with and it runs in families, but she knows of nothing
in her family or the father's that would sponsor this, and she
volunteered that she'd heard severe trauma could affect a child that
way, but she didn't know of any such events in her life that could
qualify, and when she talked with the original doc he said that
trauma only spawned those symptoms in older kids, usually not kids
that young (started when she was barely 4).
Now for some context, you'd have to understand that this kid -- other
than these stories -- is a sweet little girl. She's barely seven
years old. She has a hard life, with a single mother in near poverty
who with her kids ages is lucky to have time to pee never mind
actually play with the child. She is just like every other little
girl in first grade. Except that her mom can't go to the bathroom
without taking the newborn, in fear THE VOICES might just tell
Brooklyn to do something terrible to it.
Well this is sort of disconcerting.
Part of me thinks that I'd really rather not have my kid play with
her anymore frankly.
Another part of me thinks that her problem is tragic enough without
taking her best and only friend away; she's on medication and the
adults are aware of the issue. Occasionally coming over to play with
barbies or swing in the backyard is not going to be a big risk.
The thing is, she and Ry BONDED SO FAST that I knew there had to be
something about Brooklyn that she was just totally drawn to, I just
didn't know what. There are lots of girls in her class and her
school but none she treats like Brooklyn. I am sort of wondering
what it is.
Personally, this sounds like a textbook example of the kind of thing
Robert Bruce was talking about in his book on psychic protection. I
know, I was making some jokes about the thing with moles and freckles
possibly being evil being way too much for me, and since I generally
believe we create our reality I don't have much fear, but hearing
this account of this innocent little girl who feels overwhelmed by
all the commanding voices in her head really weirded me out.
Ry says Brooklyn talks about the voices. They scare her. She feels
whatever they say, she MUST do. It's not even an option. Classic
schizophrenia.... but in a 4 year old? A 7 year old?
I am wondering -- as I have before, this just brought it close up --
what part natural psychic openness plays in seeming mental
disorders. Now in older people, part of the problem is even if the
stimulus is genuinely "just psi", they are usually so torqued by that
time, that even normal info is a little twisted inside them, never
mind psychic info. But a child is a lot more pure, especially a
child whose primary life problem has been too much TV as opposed to
anything truly life threatening. What the hell would cause that??
Ry has terrible dreams, she tells me. She dreams that I have been
shot, stabbed, chopped up, or otherwise killed regularly. She dreams
she finds me dead in the back of the pickup, offbeat stuff I don't
know what to make of. She doesn't want to tell me about them, and I
don't force her but do try to encourage her to do so. She is six and
still doesn't want to sleep alone, although she admits to me that "I
have bad dreams even when I'm sleeping right NEXT to you," as if
betrayed that mommy-safety could be that close and still the 'bad
stuff' would get in her head. I assume this must be normal, as I
recall having VIVID and CONSTANT horrible nightmares when I was age 5
and 6. I don't remember my parents dying in them, but some were so
shockingly vivid and gory that I remember them 32 years later! So I
guess it's not all that unusual, her dreams, but it made me wonder if
somehow, some part of her was tuned into Brooklyn because they shared
some terrible fear of something.
Well I don't really know where I'm going with this. I'm kind of
shocked to be honest and not sure if there's anything I should do
(and hanging garlic chains around the house is possible here, but
probably not at Brooklyn's, lol). Has anybody else encountered
extremely young children acting in such bizarre ways? Does this
sound like mental illness -- or psychic warfare?
PJ
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#1686
From: "Nita Hickok"
Date: Tue Dec 10, 2002 11:09 am
Subject: Re: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? nitahickok
Hi PJ
I know that if I were working on this case.( I do work on people
with problems. I ask for a donation of any amount a person can afford
and wants to send. I pay for the computer this way. I will start work
immediately and will do the work without a donation if the person
can't afford to send one.) I would first conisider all of the
factors. The child could have been abused with out the mother knowing
it. Psyhciatric care would be a must for the Mother to do. I would be
sure the girl was regulated. I would then banish anything around her
and exorcise the house.
I suggest that the person with problems be banished in a triangle
of energy that makes it where it can't escape. I normally use salt to
form the triangle on the ground away from any people.. I then have
the person go swimming in lake, river or pool while I remove it from
the triangle and banish it forever. Spirits can not cross running
water. I take a brush and brush the salt away so the shape doesn't
stay on the ground.
I do use angels like Saint Michael to do this and in a childs case
would make it as simple as possible. You energize the triangle
immediately so if the child steps out and goes swimming the voices or
negs stay in the triangle.
The psychiatrist then gets to take over to get to the root of the
problem. I work upon the victim to keep the energetic system
balanced. A unbalanced energetic system is the way any of the negs
can attach to others. It is caused by any traumatic moments such as
deaths in the family, illness, accidents, or other traumas. I have
helped people with schizophrenia and made life a lot easier for them.
I believe that a lot of schizophrenics are talented people who
can't differentiate other levels of reality from this one. They then
see and hear things that others don't see. They say what is going on
and people instantly medicate them. I believe that a combination of
methods both psychiatric and spiitual works the best.
Nita
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#1689
From: Bill Pendragon
Date: Tue Dec 10, 2002 8:28 pm
Subject: Re: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? docsavagebill
Hi Palyne,
Here's a website describing schizophrenia. Although
negative auditory halluciantions are a hallmark of it,
this girl seems too young for the disease from what
I've read. Usually it presents in early 20's.
Perhaps neg. influence by entities is a possibility.
You can try Bruce's running water trick just to see???
http://www.clevelandclinicmeded.com/diseasemanagement/psychiatry/
schizophrenia/schizophrenia.htm#signssymptoms
The first episode of schizophrenia typically occurs in
the late teenage years or the early 20s. Early
recognition is hindered by the often-insidious
prodrome of schizophrenia, which includes subtle,
non-specific problems in language, cognitive ability,
and behavior.21 Frequently, neurotic features (social
anxiety, panic attacks, and obsessional ideas),
antisocial behavior, or substance misuse dominate the
clinical picture and obscure the underlying
psychosis.22 Functional deficits such as emotional
flattening, social withdrawal, and a lack of
motivation and pleasure are usually prominent.22 The
most commonly reported psychotic features are auditory
hallucinations and delusions.........
Bill
pjrv : Messages : 1685-1691 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/1685?)
23:17:10
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#1685
From: Weatherly-Hawaii...m
Date: Tue Dec 10, 2002 1:29 am
Subject: Re: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? maliolana
Aloha PJ,
ummm...I know one thing for sure...Your daughter is very advanced for her
age...6 is not the average age for a child to conceive of death...(I
think they say it is around 9)...or so they say...
Her little friend could have so many reasons why...she is suffering such
disabilities...for one thing ...child molesters commonly target single
moms...
for they are ready made for their sick purposes...easy victimizing
children in ones own house...and with all these pregnancies and tiny
tots...mom would definately have moments of neglecting one or more of
these children...One parent is not enough...In fact...I don't even
believe two is...
Unless this child is suffering from some kind of organic poisoning(heavy
metals) ...or birth defect...or substance consumed by the mother during
pregnancy...She may well have been victimized and the mother have no
knowledge of this at all...I find this is very common amoung my grown
friends...while mom was at work or so many other scenarios...Shockingly
so...Mothers boyfriends...or the neighbor...and their mothers never
knew...
This baby sounds traumatized...and it seems as if your baby is empathetic
for her...Surprisingly sexually abused children may never even show
symptoms untill much later...perhaps in their teens...or even
older...before they begin to act out...Usually through
promiscuity...drug/a;cohol abuse...prostitution...
I feel so sad and scared for this little girl...mom is not in any
position to truly help her...no disrespect for the mother...After all she
is human...and children need many more than one adult in their
life...They simply cannot be watched 24/7...especially with so many
tinier ones around...I also lament the lousy medical/psychological care
available for the poor...US wide... but especially in say Oklahoma...the
South.......What little attention they may receive is insufficient and
cost directed...and frequently incompetant...
I hope mom got her tubes tied...for all of this little families
sanity...I can't image taking care of 4 small children 24/7...I had a
friend many years ago who's husband deserted her and three small
stairstep children...the mom eventually devolved into truly neglecting
the children and had to go into a psychiatric ward for a while...and the
children went into the state welfare child protective system...I lost
contact after that...but it was so sad...
I can imagine how this must have effected you...hell I am upset for
them...
and this has been on my mind all day...I wish there was something I could
do
to help...We have millions of neglected/abused/traumatized children out
there...Neglected by our entire society...in the US alone...I just don't
get it...
Is this baby seeing any professionals?...A few truly caring doctors do
take some patients gratis...usually through friends/etc...
Love & Light & Laughter
Mali'o...aka...Dawna
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#1687
From: Rfjuice...
Date: Tue Dec 10, 2002 8:32 am
Subject: Re: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? rfjuice2000
Hi PJ,
I know of an instance very similar to what you describe. Single mother
circumstance, also. This child started as soon as she could put things into
words, about 3 yrs old, she would constantly be seeing a man trying to kill
her, dreams, nightmares, voices . The mother didn't know how to handle it.
The little girl wasn't suicidal, but terrified. When she went to school they
finally wore the mother down to put her on ritalin which was totally wrong
for her. The mother had another doctor evaluate her, and she had to go
through detox because they had her on so much medication.
Long story short, she ended up in a special school for 2 years, which was
excellent for her, and her medications are changed. It has been a long and
difficult road. She is now 16, and doing rather well.
As far as mental illness vs. psychic warfare, I have often wondered the
same thing about her situation myself.
I think Nita's post makes a lot of sense.
Best Wishes,
Linda
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#1690
From: Karl Boyken
Date: Wed Dec 11, 2002 11:19 am
Subject: Re: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? kboyken
PJ, I'm certainly no expert, but there are a number of
different possibilities here, I'd think--schizophrenia,
abuse, possession, psychic attack. If there is a
practicing shaman in your area and if Brooklyn's mother
is open to suggestion, it might be worth it to try that
route, especially if medical treatment isn't doing much
good.
Karl
--
Karl Boyken
kboyken...t
http://soli.inav.net/~kboyken/
We dance 'round in a ring and suppose,
while the Secret sits in the middle and knows.
--Robert Frost
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#1691
From: Rocheleh
Date: Wed Dec 11, 2002 3:56 pm
Subject: Re: Psi and Schizophrenia / possession? rochelehhakt...
Hi PJ & all,
Schizophrenia in children is called very early onset schizophrenia. It is
assumed to be very rare. I'd elaborate on the whole issue, but I have six exams
next week (this is not an overstatement, this is a messed-up schedule) so I
barely have time to read my correspondence.
This condition's so rare that my general textbooks I have at home don't have
anything worthwhile on the topic. I could do a library/journals search, but
that's only possible if I survive next week - which I'm not so sure about at
this point
However, (and _please don't_ take this as the opinion of somebody in the field
-I'm in my first semester!) I would attempt a more psi-related explanation.
People don't bond this much and this fast to schizophrenics (though nothing can
be derived from a single case of course), at least I've never heard about that.
To the contrary, schizophrenics can be lacking in social skills.
(Thought I'd mention that there is a view that schizophrenia is a continuum,
from normal to 'weird' to schizotypic to schizophrenic. I'd agree with this, and
genetical facts also seem to support this, but please don't ask me to give
citations, because I don't even know what I should know for my exams... but if
anyone is interested, I might dig up proper references later on.)
I have seen, first- and second-person, such bonding processes, with individuals
who were more open to psi. (This was not necessarily a good thing.)
[It is entirely possible that individuals who are more prone to psi are the same
with schizophrenia (biological basis?), why not? The question did arise, but I
recall little more than anecdotical findings. I'm planning on catching up on
literature in the winter break.]
I would try to teach her some psi defense, (To Rykah - but if I could, I would
at least try to do something with Brooklyn) it can't really make the situation
worse... provided you don't start off like I did back a few years ago, ouch! I
thought I would do well with 'airtight' protection, I haven't figured I need
'air' to breathe - in a metaphorical sense. Well, it happens. I'm still here,
though. :) But your method about clearness is something similar to what I've
been using for the past half a year or so, and to my initial surprise, it works.
(Frankly, I didn't have the energy to put up wards after I moved, so this was a
bootstrap solution at first. But it turned out right, so I thought I'd keep it.
Then I read something like it turned out right for you, and I felt reassured. :)
) If you've done so already, then some more psi defense.
Did the psychs put her immediately on medication? Do I understand it right that
she's *on medication* and *still has symptoms this overwhelming*? If so, what
did they say about this? Have they tried other drugs? A more psychological
approach? (When somebody is a threat to others' lives, I can see what the point
is in medication. But medication alone, I don't think that's ever sufficient.)
There are some very simple behavioristic exercises that might work - or might
not, of course. The made-infamous-by-Orwell thoughtstop can be surprisingly
effective if done right; though I've seen it in action only for compulsive
thoughts, not hallucinations.
Something else: commanding voices (not just voices, *commanding* voices) are
rather typical of some forms of schizophrenia, IIRC... and not typical for other
forms of mental illness. While hallucinations, even auditory ones, might appear
under a plethora of conditions.) But I'd have to look into differential
diagnosis to say this for certain.
And something trivial: has she tried asking the voices who they were? If so, did
they answer? If so, what did they say?
Rachel (My, this message turned out to be so disorganized...)
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