pjrv : Messages : 274-278 of 4038
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#274
From: jsentient...
Date: Mon Jul 29, 2002 3:09 pm
Subject: symbolism & autonomy jsentient
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Hi RV'rs,
Some of my most interesting and successful remote viewing sessions included
symbolic images and notions. Some of the symbols I have learned over many
different targets and are consistent, some occur but once. Usually, the
first time a symbol comes, it also seems to come with a sense for what it
might represent. That sense is very subtle.
An example is -- I often see in my mental imagery a jumble of lines, like a
pile of pixy stixs, it's a chaotic nest of lines in every which direction,
but mostly straight lines. This has been a fairly reliable indicator for me
that the target contains life. I like to think of it as representing hair or
feathers. Other symbols are much more abstract, but you get the idea.
I also get very direct target characteristics, especially shape, texture,
geometry etc. But I am not writing about those right now.
Another thing, and many of you may not experience this (probably less than
the symbol thing), I sometimes feel that while the information IS the target,
there is an intermediary. Many might consider this to be the subconscious.
And it may be,,,,hell if I know. But I suspect it is autonomous. I feel an
effort in communication going on,,,,two awareness' involved, (just) one being
my conscious mind.
And this is why I have mentioned the symbols. Symbols are a fundamental
hallmark of communication. In fact, it can't happen without symbolism. And,
it doesn't happen without more than one awareness. Communication implies two.
So, I wonder about this autonomy other than my consciousness. It's difficult
for me to think about it as subconsciousness. I kind of think the sub is
supposed to be just a more fundamental aspect of myself. I have trouble
thinking of myself as more than one (the notion of self as more than one is
an oxymoron, a paradox). No doubt my mind, like everyone's, is a complex
thing, with different levels of awareness and info processing, but different
levels does not translate to independent autonomous dialog. At least doesn't
seem like it would to me.
Palyne's archetype work also seems full of VERY autonomous dialog. It's
interesting. And I know a lot of psychic's talk about guides and spirits.
Mostly, I don't like such notions, not sure why, but they don't appeal to me.
I also remember the imaginary friend I had When I was a three or four year
old child. As for my imaginary friend, he seemed as if part of a lucid
dream,,,,,I could in part control him, who he was, and how he
reacted/acted,,,,he wasn't totally autonomous, but even so, he often seemed
so.
Anyway, I don't think guides or imaginary friends are involved in remote
viewing. I don't really know what's going on to be honest.
But I will share a remote viewing experience that involved symbolic
"communication" of target information. Some of you may have already read
this account from me, and my monitor/tasker was Mary Ashley at the time (hi
Mary). She had assigned (of course unbeknownst to me) the target "man's
first steps on the moon." I got a lot of information on this target, but
right now I will only share the info that came as symbolism. As I remote
viewed this target, early in my session, in my mind I saw three men standing
with their backs to me. Suddenly these three men dropped their pants and
bent over. They mooned me.
How funny! And I had to laugh at the time. But here in this
example/experience we see symbolism and more, we see humor. The sense of
(other) autonomy, of communication seems so strong to me.
Well, I don't get much time to be involved with the list, but I saw that
Palyne wanted shared experience and participation, so I figured I better get
a post off.
BTW, many months later it hit me,,,,,it wasn't just the butt view which
indicated the moon that was meaningful. The number three was relevent.
Well, hope I am not way out there,,,,,that perhaps some of you might relate.
If not, oh well.
Symbolism, it makes me smile.
Jay
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#278
From: "Mary Ashley"
Date: Tue Jul 30, 2002 6:44 am
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy maryladyoflight
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Hi Jay :))))
> They mooned me.
How can I ever forget that one.. :)) And blowing you off an exploding Mt St
Helens.. LOL. BTW, I was really saddened that the inside of a tin of baked
beans seemed to put you off doing sessions with me. As I said at the time,
not everything is spectacular.. ah well.
Regarding symbolism... I had been attempting a new form of emotional
healing on myself, which I saw on the web.. It involves asking the sub for
an image to represent an issue.. and then tapping certain meridian points.
The image doesn't need to make sense.. In fact, there isn't any need to
actually know what the core issue is.. just that there is a fear or general
unease about 'something'.
I have discovered that there isn't any need to tap the points, intention to
resolve the issue is sufficient.. and that it works!!!!! The emotional
issue was resolved. Quite profoundly too. Now, in hindsight, the image made
100% sense.
I also discovered that more images presented themselves.. until they
disolved into nothingness. These images too began to fit.. almost like
'proofs', even coming up in the course of conversations from other peoples
mouths, days later. EG.. one image I got was of a chick and a fried egg.
They seemed to alternate before my eyes.. then over a week later, I found
myself listening to someone discussing which came first, the chicken or the
egg. The image which followed that was of a bowling ball... Last night we
had a huge electrical storm, which raged over head for hours. When I was a
child, I was told that God was playing skittles. (A form of bowling in the
UK.)
I am only just beginning to explore this discovery.. and how it may be
utilised. Perhaps it may be possible to heal others emotional pain.. to
heal physical issues.. to resolve conflicts with others before they occur..
(I've got one coming up, so I can have a go.) The follow up images can only
be beneficial to the client, regarding the healing side.. as if the
'proofs' are right, then the healing must be working. Right? And there is
nothing like that personal experience to prove it. :))
Of course, as there is nothing new under the sun, I expect this form of
healing has been around for eons.. still, it's new to me and maybe new to
others here.. I am keen to learn more of how this sub providing the imagery
for healing can be utilised, s, if others would like to have a go.. how
they used it.. and let me know their results.. either here or on
innerlight, or privately.
:))
Mary Ashley
pjrv : Messages : 284-438 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/284?)
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#284
From: joan003...nk.net
Date: Tue Jul 30, 2002 1:59 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy joanie003
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<>
Hi Jay,
especially when it's mooning you?
I recall the target you posted that included two religious symbols...one
being Christ on the crucifix looking down..I kept getting the image of this
warn torn ravaged city and a bunch of hobos, trying to get warm around an
inner city fire and it was "Christmas time." One of the men present was
this man that loomed large before me, looking down at me as if to
say..."what are YOU doing here?" Despite it literally being a huge "aol"
that would never work for strict CRV applications, the symbolism and the
mood of what I experienced captured the feeling/aura for me.
I really enjoyed that target immensely....
In the Spirit,
Joanie
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#288
From: "Sharon Webb"
Date: Tue Jul 30, 2002 4:27 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy sharwebb_30512
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Hi,
I've noticed over and over how literal some symbols are. They are more often
than not visual puns. The pun symbols seem to be "born on the spot" to convey a
specific message, while the recurring symbols seem to be what Silva people call
"points of reference" and seem meant to trigger a "knowing" that a certain
condition exists --- in the same way that a yellow traffic light triggers the
meaning of "caution." These recurring symbols are usually of meaning only to
the individual practitioner while the visual puns can often be translated by
anyone...as in the "moon" symbol you mention.
It gets interesting when mental symbols translate into real life events. :-)
Sharon
sharwebb...net
www.fractalus.com/sharon
----- Original Message -----
From: jsentient... Some of my most interesting and successful remote
viewing sessions included symbolic images and notions. Some of the symbols I
have learned over many different targets and are consistent, some occur but
once. Usually, the first time a symbol comes, it also seems to come with a
sense for what it might represent. That sense is very subtle. SNIP
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#291
From: jsentient...
Date: Tue Jul 30, 2002 2:45 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy jsentient
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Hi Sharon,
<< These recurring symbols are usually of meaning only to the individual
practitioner while the visual puns can often be translated by anyone.. >>
I guess my wonder is that we get symbols at all. Why symbols?
I do find symbolism fascinating in general. And, I believe it is
intrinsically linked to PSI, but beyond that thought, I don't have any
answers.
Have you ever encountered a story which is rich in metaphor and hidden
meaning? Hemingway wrote like that. One can discover symbols within
symbols,,,,many levels of embedded and encoded representation. Quite a
delight.
I must say though, that my best remote viewing successes generally did not
make use of symbols. In those I received extremely fast visual flashes.
They are so fast I can barely capture them. And, they usually are quite
surprising.
I mention these flashes here because I wonder if anyone else gets these. I
read nothing in the RV literature that indicates it can be part of RV
perception. In fact, on the contrary, I find references that guard against
any image that is "too" articulate and life like. Yet for me, these flashes
can be almost photo quality. They are rare, but when I get them, they have
always been a part of the target.....so far anyway.
Anyway, back to symbols. Why are they so pervasive in PSI? (I don't really
expect anyone to know) Must be a reason though. :)
Jay
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#438
From: "dennanm"
Date: Fri Aug 9, 2002 3:43 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy dennanm
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Howdy Jay,
> I guess my wonder is that we get symbols at all. Why symbols?
I've been thinking about this. I have to theorize -- not very
innovative of course -- that what we call reality is really our own
symbolic interpretation of what physicists would consider a big
energy soup, with a variety of vibrating energy. Perhaps when we
tune into things via psi, we are technically going 'to the source' --
to the energy itself. And much of the time, it translates in our
typical way. But perhaps, because it is a 'translation', the state
of mind during our session affects how things come through.
In other words, perhaps it's not just that 'some' RV data is
symbolic. Perhaps everything in existence and ALL RV data
is 'symbolic' -- it's simply that symbols which match our "consensus
agreement about reality" we consider 'literal' simply because it
matches what we think of as real.
Maybe a viewer would get one data component one day; a symbolic
component another day; something yet different on a third day; just
depending on the flux of the consciousness (from body to emotions to
mind to perhaps something else) of the viewer at any given time?
Regards,
PJ
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#293
From: "Sharon Webb"
Date: Tue Jul 30, 2002 7:13 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy sharwebb_30512
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Jay,
I can only guess why symbols are so pervasive in psi, but my guess is that
receiving is basically a function of the right brain which has no language. But
the right brain can receive visual images, and the like. Then I think these
concepts are sent through the corpus callosum of the brain into the left brain
where it is translated into words. I think this accounts for not only psi, but
also chanelling and other similar occurrences.
I know what you mean by visual flashes. I get them so fast that they usually
don't completely register. It's a sense of crystal clarity moving at the speed
of lightning. If anyone knows how to slow them down I'd love to know the
secret. The flashes give me the impression that if I could freeze frame them
I'd really be amazed at the amount of detail they contain. Perhaps they do
"stick" though in some fashion. Maybe they are related to what Robert Monroe
called "rotes" and which I always thought of as thought balls. They come in
very fast and leave whole (but fleeting) concepts in my mind. They never come
in the form of words though and I'm usually very aware of the translation
process when I try to relay the information they carry.
Sharon
sharwebb...net
www.fractalus.com/sharon
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#302
From: aeonblue8008...
Date: Tue Jul 30, 2002 6:24 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy aeonblueau
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In a message dated 7/30/2002 6:26:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
sharwebb...net writes:
> www.fractalus.com/sharon
G'day! Sharon
Absolutely lovely site!
I'm an underground fractal junkie (aka the underground doesn't have a site
link on the infinite fractal loop).
When I saw Rose and Lace.... that's what I have been looking for, couldn't
quite put my finger(mind) on it, that's it. (the effect 3-d)
Beautiful work there gal.
I now have XenoDream, hesitated coz this machine sucks enough of my
time(mind) already :-)
Keeping on with the subject of E-RV, I recently ERVed a fractal, was quite a
ride, I worked several sessions. (when can you say enough is enough?)
I always came out of session with the feeling I wasn't done and there was
more to get. (such is the infinite fractal) , with taskers such as mine who
needs enemies.. jus kidding...
(fractal ='s mathematical formulas. Unending)
Passed a bit on to Pendragon(BillPhD) re fractals, told him the universe
comes down to a bar code..
(surprisingly he didn't think I was too far off for a blonde)
Just poppin in real quick PJ..... i'm on holiday and I know I never say
anything anyway . . . . .
BTW.. great read Neuromancer, an old cyber punk classic.
(folks usually respond duhhuh? to this question)
A very must for RVer's, 5 stars IMO..
then add the movie The Thirteenth Floor..
all the best....
~T~
hacking the matrix, what are hollidays for
life's a beach
bang on
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#306
From: "Sharon Webb"
Date: Wed Jul 31, 2002 12:26 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy sharwebb_30512
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Hi,
Thanks for the nice words about my site.
And to bring this email back on subject, please tell more about what happened
when you ERV'd the fractal. You referred to a wild ride. I wonder if you
experienced anything like I did when I plunged into fractals on several
occasions. It was certainly a subjective wild ride for me. It was as if I were
sliding down deeper and deeper inside, and going faster and faster. Beat any
carnival ride I've ever had...and prettier, too.
Sharon
sharwebb...net
www.fractalus.com/sharon
----- Original Message -----
From: aeonblue8008...
Keeping on with the subject of E-RV, I recently ERVed a fractal, was quite a
ride, I worked several sessions. (when can you say enough is enough?)
pjrv : Messages : 453-494 of 4038
(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/pjrv/messages/453?)
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#453
From: jsentient...
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 12:30 pm
Subject: Re: Re: symbolism & autonomy jsentient
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In a message dated 08/09/2002 8:36:58 PM Central Daylight Time,
palyne...horizon.com writes:
<< Howdy Jay,
> I guess my wonder is that we get symbols at all. Why symbols?
I've been thinking about this. I have to theorize -- not very
innovative of course -- that what we call reality is really our own
symbolic interpretation >>
Hi Palyne!
You are too humble, your very innovative.
Perhaps you might remember a recent beer commercial -- Budweiser, I believe
-- which presented a question (generally a rather irrelevant and unanswerable
question), and then a smart ass answer which went like this: Why ask why?
And then went on to say, just enjoy the Bud.
Why ask why? I'll tell you I just can't help it. Remote viewing is so
damned amazing, and I am a scientist or at least a technician at heart. I
want to know how everything works. Of course there is also the illusive
thought that if one were to figure it out, one could become very good at it
indeed.
I think you are right,,,,,,,the symbolism is about representation and
interpretation, and a significant part of reality must be, to an extent, an
illusion. I also agree that both, individual and mutual perceptions are
important. But beyond those considerations the questions go on and on.
I have for some time had this subtle inclination, an uneasy gut feeling that
I had to make a choice. There is no logic rationale for the feeling but it
persists. The thought was, I could be a fairly good remote viewer,
continuing to experience the awesome, or, I could be a researcher questioning
and analyzing PSI,,,, but I could not do both.
I had a dream about a week ago. It concerned this issue, understanding PSI.
In the dream there was a place I could look and I would see all the answers,
I would know how it works. The thing was, if I looked there, I would become
blind, perhaps even insane. And, to make the dream really uncomfortable,
looking there was almost impossible to avoid, it was like simple unavoidable
awareness, like a part of consciousness itself.
As I have mentioned in another thread on this list, I have no fear of PSI.
After the dream I had to ask myself if maybe I had a fear of loss of PSI.
However I think it is bigger than that. Obviously it's also about reality,
and about being human.
I wonder if there is a reason we do not know, a reason that PSI is illusive.
As a researcher, one of my basic questions would be not why does PSI occur,
but rather why doesn't PSI occur more.
Why symbols? Hmmmm. Why ask why? I think I will just remote view for a
while. ,,,,, this Bud's for you.
Jay
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#454
From: "scottrver"
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 7:07 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy scottrver
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Hi All,
I've thought a lot about why sometimes an RV session will be filled
with symbols and almost always have severely distorted data that is
nonetheless easily recognizable in the correct target from a pool.
I'm sure I'm not the first to say this but I don't remember who to
attribute what parts to. I think that what happens is that the raw
perception comes into my brain usually very quickly - although
sometimes it seems to last for a very long time (bilocation?). My
brain is then searching for various schema in which to match these
perceptions and sometimes it matches it metaphorically - hence the
symbols.
Scott
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#461
From: "dennanm"
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 11:36 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy dennanm
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Hi Jay,
> I have for some time had this subtle
> inclination, an uneasy gut feeling that
> I had to make a choice. There is no logic
> rationale for the feeling but it
> persists. The thought was, I could be a
> fairly good remote viewer,
> continuing to experience the awesome, or,
> I could be a researcher questioning
> and analyzing PSI,,,, but I could not do both.
While some researchers have done psi work, and some viewers or
psychics have done research work, top-caliber work in both areas is
not done by the same person, perhaps because the mindset and
experience of both at the extremes are nearly polarized. Or because
it's not really workable to be totally objective about something one
has to be totally immersed in (letting go of objectivity) sometimes
to make happen.
> I had a dream about a week ago. It concerned
> this issue, understanding PSI.
> In the dream there was a place I could look
> and I would see all the answers,
> I would know how it works. The thing was, if
> I looked there, I would become
> blind, perhaps even insane. And, to make the
> dream really uncomfortable,
> looking there was almost impossible to avoid,
> it was like simple unavoidable
> awareness, like a part of consciousness itself.
Wow. That's interesting. I think our dreams often speak to us about
our work in psi if we bother to remember them or consider them. Not
long ago I had a really intense dream obviously about psi (about a
third eye in my forehead, lol!) that sort of played on what in
retrospect I'd consider a fear of a death of one part of me if
another were allowed to 'become'.
> As I have mentioned in another thread on
> this list, I have no fear of PSI.
Yeah that's what I said too. ;-)
> After the dream I had to ask myself if maybe
> I had a fear of loss of PSI.
> However I think it is bigger than that. Obviously
> it's also about reality,
> and about being human.
Yes, the dream I mentioned was more like that; that this affected not
just doing a session, but a whole fundamental set of structures about
who we are (and are not) and what reality is (and is not) and
potentially a major revision or loss in those categories.
> As a researcher, one of my basic questions
> would be not why does PSI occur,
> but rather why doesn't PSI occur more.
Hmmmn. I think psi occurs close to 24/7. However, I think we have a
lifetime of minute-to-minute practice in ignoring it. :-)
PJ
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#464
From: "scottrver"
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:44 am
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy scottrver
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Hi,
>> The thought was, I could be a
>> fairly good remote viewer,
>> continuing to experience the awesome, or,
>> I could be a researcher questioning
>> and analyzing PSI,,,, but I could not do both.
>
> While some researchers have done psi work, and some viewers or
> psychics have done research work, top-caliber work in both areas is
> not done by the same person, perhaps because the mindset and
> experience of both at the extremes are nearly polarized. Or because
> it's not really workable to be totally objective about something one
> has to be totally immersed in (letting go of objectivity) sometimes
> to make happen.
You can do both - I'm doing both right now and so have others. Some
researchers are considered "psi conducive" and typically have
significant personal experience in psi functioning. The trick is that
if you want to participate in your own RV experiments you have to
figure out how to target and judge yourself in a blind manner. I have
software do the targeting and other people judge my sessions and that
works. Otherwise, you can simply do remote viewing of targets not
associated with your research.
Scott
------------------------
Moderator's note: Great! Well as I mentioned, some HAVE done both. Keith Harary
("Blue" I believe he was known as, in the old days as a psychic) is just one who
comes to mind. But he's neither one of the world's greatest viewers nor the
world's greatest researchers -- at the 'extremes' I don't know anyone doing
both, but perhaps it's just a matter of time for that to happen. :-) -- PJ
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#494
From: Bill Pendragon
Date: Sun Aug 18, 2002 11:48 am
Subject: Re: Re: How Brain compiles visual concepts ..similiar to RV? docsavagebill
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Hello All,
Did you ever wonder why RV information comes in as
pieces instead of integrated whole. Here is an
interesting study on how the brain organizes visual
components..color/shape/position . Apparently these
compoents of vision are stored separately in the brain
first. Organization is cued by constant attention to
one item at a time. It seems to me that this
integration site may be the source of AOL drive. In RV
we have to relearn how to access the unintegrated
pieces before we can assemble them without invoking
the programs that identify a bananna-like item as a
bannana instead of a submarine. This also indicates
that things with solitary items in them are going to
be easier targets than complicated combinations of
things. The brain needs to focus on one item at a time
to organize impressions.
Best Wishes,
Bill
(http://www.vanderbilt.edu/)
Date: Posted 8/12/2002
Attention Acts As Visual Glue
When you gaze at a bowl of fruit, why don't some of
the bananas look red, some of the apples look purple
and some of the grapes look yellow?
This question isn't as nonsensical as it may sound.
When your brain processes the information coming from
your eyes, it stores the information about an object's
shape in one place and information about its color in
another. So it's something of a miracle that the
shapes and colors of each fruit are combined
seamlessly into distinct objects when you look at
them.
Exactly how the brain recombines these different types
of visual information after it has broken them apart
is called the "binding problem" and is currently the
subject of considerable controversy in the
neuroscience community. But the results of a brain
mapping experiment, published online by the
Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences on
July 29, provide significant new support for the
theory that attention is the glue that cements visual
information together as people scan complex visual
scenes.
The study was a collaboration among René Marois,
assistant professor of psychology at Vanderbilt; John
C. Gore, who recently moved from Yale to become a
Chancellor's University Professor at Vanderbilt; and
Yale graduate student Keith M. Shafritz.
"There are more than a dozen places in the brain
involved with processing visual information, each
specializing in information with slightly different
attributes," says Marois. "Some specialize in
processing color, some specialize in processing shape,
while others specialize in movement. These areas are
not clustered together, but distributed widely around
the back of the brain."
There are two leading theories about how the brain
reintegrates this information.
One view proposes that the neurons in the scattered
areas are bound together in a way that allows them to
act simultaneously. When you look at a banana, the
neurons that store information about the banana's
shape fire simultaneously with the neurons in a
different region of the brain that store information
about the banana's color. It is the direct functional
interaction between neurons located in different
visual areas that binds together an object's numerous
visual properties.
In the 1980's, Anne M. Triesman at Princeton and her
colleagues advanced an alternative mechanism. She
proposed that visual binding is mediated by the
parietal cortex, an area of the brain known to be
involved in spatial attention. She suggested that the
act of focusing one's attention on an object's spatial
location provides the key that binds the different
types of visual information together. If an apple is
sitting on the table in front of a woman, then her
brain, specifically the parietal cortex, associates
the information about its color and shape with its
location and uses the spatial information to bind
together the visual information whenever she focuses
her attention on the apple.
The description of a patient who, following a brain
injury in the parietal lobe, had difficulty
associating colors with more than one object at a time
gave Marois the idea for the basic experiment. When
the person was presented with objects one at a time,
he had no problem properly pairing their shapes and
colors. When presented with two or more objects at the
same time, however, he often mismatched the color of
one object with the shape of another.
So Marois designed a series of trials that asked
subjects to concentrate on the shape only, the color
only or both shape and color of pairs of objects
displayed on a computer screen while their brain
activity was monitored using the technique called
functional MRI. The researchers presented these pairs
to the individuals either sequentially in the same
location or simultaneously at different locations and
recorded the areas in the brain that were most active.
"The purpose of our study was really to test the
attention theory as strongly as we could," says
Marois. "I was actually surprised that it worked
because we had to adopt such stringent testing
conditions."
Despite their stringency, the tests showed that
activity in the parietal region increased
significantly whenever the individuals were presented
with more than one object at the same time.
"This provides strong evidence in favor of the theory
that spatial attention is the binding glue that the
brain uses to integrate visual objects whenever it is
presented with more than one object at the same time,
which is most of the time," says Marois.
While the study results support the attention theory,
they do not rule out other mechanisms. "In fact," he
adds, "it is practically certain that the brain uses
several mechanisms to solve this fascinating problem."
The project was funded by a grant from the National
Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke.
For more news about research at Vanderbilt, visit
Exploration, Vanderbilt's online research magazine at
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#469
From: jsentient...
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 3:02 pm
Subject: Re: Re: symbolism & autonomy jsentient
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Hi Palyne,
<< > As a researcher, one of my basic questions
> would be not why does PSI occur,
> but rather why doesn't PSI occur more.
Hmmmn. I think psi occurs close to 24/7. However, I think we have a
lifetime of minute-to-minute practice in ignoring it. :-) >>
Could be,,,,but the question remains,,,,,,why would that be? Why would we do
that?
Shoot,,,,,there I go again, asking the why questions,,,LOL! Damn, it's
almost like breathing.
Jay
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#470
From: "dennanm"
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 8:06 pm
Subject: Re: symbolism & autonomy dennanm
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Hiya Jay,
> Hmmmn. I think psi occurs close to 24/7.
> However, I think we have a
> lifetime of minute-to-minute practice in ignoring it. :-)
> Could be,,,,but the question remains,,,,,,why would that be?
> Why would we do that?
I think we have to. From the time we're babies, the primary survival
activity is learning to interpret what our parents (etc.) perceive
as "reality" from some gigantic energy soup. Like tuning in a radio
station, I think much of our most formative years are constant fine-
tuning of 'where' in a massive matrix or stream of frequencies the
thing our parents call reality 'is'.
When I was nursing my little girl, she would be lying there suckling
and her eyes would be half open, staring straight ahead/up generally,
kind of spaced out. One time I was remembering an experience I'd had
with a hands-on energy worker, and I casually visualized a stream of
gold sparkly light going out of my forehead in a spiral and into
hers, and the moment I did it, her little eyes popped WIDE open in
astonishment and stared at my forehead in utter fascination. Then it
was my turn to be astonished -- I hadn't thought about her physically
SEEING it, I just wanted to give her some mommy-love energy in that
way at that time. I used to play with that a lot then, just to get
her reaction. I just couldn't get over how she responded.
Also when she was a baby, my husband Lu and I finally decided, with
no doubt whatever, that she was clearly operating in more than one of
what we'd call dimension.
She'd be sitting there in the giant bean bag, for example. We'd be
working on our computers. Then she'd look over, doing a sort of
double take, and then laugh delightedly. Then would entail a period
of two to 15 minutes where she giggled and responded exactly as she
did when WE were playing peek-a-book and such with her... except...
she was playing with someone who as far as WE were concerned, was
simply not there. I mean there was no doubt whatever that she was
having an engaging interaction with someone. It's just that we
couldn't see the someone.
The bottle (when she was older) was another thing. It simply popped
in and out of existence constantly. We thought we were imagining
this for a long time of course. We finally decided we weren't. If
WE put it somewhere, like say, on our bedside table, it would be
there eternally if necessary, until we went to get it. If SHE put it
there, it might not be there. We could be looking everywhere for it,
and it was not there. I could repeatedly look somewhere, thinking it
HAD to be there because she hadn't gone anywhere, and it wouldn't be
there. He could look as well. We'd both look. We'd get hacked off
and go make another. Then, without her moving, it would just be
there. At first, you think this is overlooking something obvious,
but after awhile with this kind of thing happening constantly it
becomes clear something else is going on. It's like any object in
her hand that got put down might or might not actually be "here" as
we know it, as if her 'aim' wasn't 100% clean yet... although if we
looked at looked, with her present to perceive this (to whatever
ability she might have had at that age), eventually it would simply
pop into existence in a place we had looked at least 20 times and
often was right there in front of us.
These three things are just little things, and they didn't form my
theory on babies having to learn to 'tune in' the reality of their
parents (that's been covered by a zillion authors including Casteneda
and Seth), but those things did seem to support the theory.
Just thoughts...
PJ
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#471
From: "Nita...ulse.com"
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 8:11 pm
Subject: Re: Re: symbolism & autonomy nitahickok
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Hi PJ
We are also taught that to see things other people don't see is wrong. It
is probably why a lot of people have to relearn psi abilities. We all have
them but some people have them really blocked off because of childhood
programming.
It is overwhealming with some abilities to go through life on this
crowded planet. The person really has to learn to turn psi abilities on and
off at will. The failures are under medication in a mental hospital or not
functioning in society at all.
Nita
The early bird still has to eat worms
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#472
From: "Sharon Webb"
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:06 pm
Subject: Re: Re: symbolism & autonomy sharwebb_30512
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Palyne,
I noticed a similar thing with my grandson when he was a few months old. I
"showered" him with golden energy, and he looked at me with astonishment and
then laughed. :-)
Sharon
sharwebb...net
www.fractalus.com/sharon
> I casually visualized a stream of
> gold sparkly light going out of my forehead in a spiral and into
> hers, and the moment I did it, her little eyes popped WIDE open in
> astonishment and stared at my forehead in utter fascination.
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#473
From: joan003...nk.net
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 11:50 pm
Subject: Re: Re: symbolism & autonomy joanie003
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Hiya Jay :-)
I found insights to the questions that you ask in reading folks like Robert
Anton Wilson, "Coincidance," anything by Starhawk (Spiral Dance for one)
and the tradition of Creation Spirituality ala Matthew Fox, Brian Swimme (a
scientist/cosmologist), and Thomas Berry - (get his lectures...this is
EXACTLY what he's been talking about for years!). :-))) Also in studying
the nature of fractals, crop circle formations, and holograms and true
magic/medicine and how it manifests...synchronicity. I think of The Tao
of Chaos by Katya Walter. And most recently Dr. Simeon Hein in Opening
Minds goes simply and deeply into why this 24/7 in touch with the mystery
of Creation is knocked out of us by the conditioning of the mechanized
world (we have evolved towards)? you jest gotta get that book if this is
on your mind.
Children get 35,000 commercials before they even start grade
school..hmmmm...do you think that could influence them away from a creation
synchronicity cosmology and into a cosmology that revolves around
consumerism and the CLOCK? If the Clock dictates our time for the most
part, how are we to ever be in touch with the minute to minute...hey
remember the poets like William Blake? that was before the Clock was a
false god :-) zeee poets of old...or the Aboriginals and the Dreamtime.
On the clock, I recall hearing Sister Jose Hobday, a Seneca woman speak
from her experience years ago...and she said...that her elders had told
her..."There's one thing that you need to learn about the white folks and
that's that they rule their lives by the clock." gosh...I feel sickened to
know how true that conditioning is with me..and I LOVE my watch as
well..can't be without it...drives me crazeee...must be the flowers on it.
personally for alarm clocks, I use a Zen alarm clock,. which has a ding
based on what it is ...that seashell theory??? fibonacci spirals I
think......and only when I absolutely am in fear of not rising in the
morning...we don't have cocks that crow in my neighborhood...sigh....:-0
O I lament I lament I lament....just as you do...but really I think there
are some pretty good folks that have put together some ideas on why we
ignore the 24/7 psi... they're out there....check 'em out Bro!!!
Love ya,
Joanie
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#477
From: Weatherly-Hawaii...m
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 6:13 pm
Subject: Re: Re: symbolism & autonomy maliolana
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Aloha PJ,
When I was pregnant with my first child/son...I tried an experiment of
'going in' to visit ...This occurred just after his quickening...around
6 mos. or so,,,I always sang and talked and taught the ABC's /asnd
1-10...aloud to him... but this time...I decided to try and communicate
on a psi level...
I got very still/calm... and began to go into my body (mentally)and into
the womb and then into my child...I used the most loving and beautiful
silent voice to say and send...Aloha...(Love and hello)
He immediately (swiftly!) curled into an extremely hard knot on one side
of my belley and trembled...He was terrified...It took me some time to
convince the tiny critter that I meant well and no harm...hahahah...and
to calm him...
I think he thought he was god and alone untill then...his religion must
have been that of my heart beating...What a culture shock for him it must
have been...Must have been akin to a loud yet silent voice coming from
the sky
and the whole world reverberating with it in shock...
I had most whole heartedly desired a daughter...and almost had myself
convinced ...it was a girl...but shortly after this visit...a knowing
came...I believe sent (probably chemically)... that my baby to be was a
boy...and by
the time he was born... I was very happy with this......I got the girl
next...and that is a whole nother story...Her name is Deja and that was
way before the song!...haha
I also breast fed and practised psi with my little ones...it works well
untill they get older and then the line gets thinner...but can usually be
reutilized with some hard work throughout their life...To a much lessor
degree of course...
I have always intuited that they are geniuses (all babies) ...and that
they know all the answers to the secrets...humynity has yearned for)...as
we all were tiny gods & geniuses... and the shock of the flesh
...combined with the ignorance of our parents and their parents...on ad
finitum...reduces us to amnesia...and even lowers potential IQ...not to
mention EQ...of course there are always exceptions......
Babies are my favorite people... because they are not only adorable and
funny...but because they are the most genuine of all...They remind us
all...
that there is hope ...their existance gives credance to our
existance...and
the feeling that ...this could be the one...to help us all
mature......
Like Drum preyed in 'Roots"..."Is you da one chile...is you da one?"...I
also held each of my new born children up ...to the sheltering arms of a
giant tree and sent my wishes and gratitude for their shelter and
nurturance and that this child might know and understand their
significance...I am sorta of a reborn pagan......I still knock on
wood!...hahaha
Love & Light & Laughter
Mali'o...aka...Dawna
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